Buying first boat....advice needed.

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Buying first boat....advice needed.

Postby TMAC » Tue May 16, 2006 6:13 pm

Hi folks,

Myself and a couple of mates are going chipping in to buy our first boat. None of us are very experienced in the ways of buying and looking after a boat but all are keen and fairly sensible. We have been chartering boats now for a few years for day trips and now its time to take the plunge.
We were thinking of an Orkney, something between 16 & 19 feet and have a buget of around 7k so its the second hand market. The apolloduck.ie website is the best site ive found for choice.....does anyone know any other good Irish sites.
I was thinking of something like this

http://www.apolloduck.ie/display.phtml?aid=36405

I would really appreciate any advice I get form this forum.

Cheers
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Postby terry » Tue May 16, 2006 7:08 pm

Id be very careful buying from the likes of the buyandsell etc as discriptions are usually way off.
Heres a cork sales yard that has one or two similar to what your looking for.
http://www.boatsales.ie/
If you were prepared to travel to the uk and tow one back you would get a much better deal.
Im sure some of the lads here will be able to help ya locate one. :D
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Postby NEWANGLE » Tue May 16, 2006 7:40 pm

http://www.boatsandoutboards.co.uk/cate ... ats?page=2

I travelled and bought in England, no regrets. Reckon I saved meself more than £3k on what it would have cost me here in fact a dealer here was after the same boat...... actually went to look at a few here first ...confirmed for me anyway that i'll take me chances in england rather than the shark infested waters here....

There are loads of the type your after on here but be patient they come on and off all the time. So you should hit the numbers as well. Ferry Travel is a minor incovenience with the new boat on the back.... my first tow was with a Merry Fisher from L/Pool up the M6 to scotland.... great experience.


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Postby steve t » Tue May 16, 2006 8:11 pm

Hi TMAC, dont think youll go far wrong with an Orkney, theyre easy to launch, tow, handle the sea well and keep theyre value. That one doesnt sound to dear, might be worth a look, Good luck with the search
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Postby Tigger » Tue May 16, 2006 9:54 pm

Hi TMAC
I bought my ALaska through boats and outboards in the UK in January and eve paying €500 for the ferry and one nights B&B I reckon I saved €5000 plus on the Irish price and as Terry said the guy in Cork at Boat sales.ie is not bad either as I got my last Orkney Strikeliner from him But bring cash and haggle as I knocked Nearly A GRAND OFF THE PRICE

Hope thats of help Tigger
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Postby Jim from Cork » Tue May 16, 2006 11:03 pm

Tmac,
The advise on sites etc. is all sound.
The boat pictured in that aplloduck link is suspiciously like a coastliner not a 520. I notice the boat is in Ireland. Ring and check that out before you waste a trip. The coastliner is a displacement hull (slow) boat the 520 or its older sister the strikeliner is semi- displacement.

Good hunting,

Jim.

This is a 520: http://www.apolloduck.ie/feature.phtml?id=40768
This is a strikeliner http://www.apolloduck.ie/feature.phtml?id=39962
Last edited by Jim from Cork on Tue May 16, 2006 11:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Fish Magnet » Tue May 16, 2006 11:09 pm

When viewing I would take along someone who is experienced with boats and engines. Failing that concentrate on the engine foremost, how old is it? look for servise history, general appearance, starting, gear change, good flow of water from the pisser, if its a Mariner/Mercury, Honda,Yamaha or Johnson/Evinrude spare parts should not be a major problem.
As for the boat, spend time checking the hull for signs of repairs [if you are comfortable that a repair is well done ask for a further discount] scrapes and stress cracks, check inside the hull esp at corners for stress cracks. Check the windows, steering and the floor.
I'm sure I missed loads, but try and go for a newer engine older boat option.

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Postby Mohawk » Wed May 17, 2006 1:11 am

Here's my 2 cents worth!

When buying any second hand boat you are only taking a gamble on the engine GOD himself can not tell the condition of an engine unless he strips it down first! You will not be in a position to strip an engine so be prepared to replace the engine or at least get some serious work done on it.

Reason for sale? Don't even ask this question you will not be told an answer like Ooooh it is a submarine, the engine is creamed, it is riddled with osmosis, it sank twice, it never gets home under its own steam etc! This will translate into something like it runs like a dream (yeah a nightmare!) I'm getting a bigger boat (your paying for it)I haven't time for fishing (I cant wait to shift this thing) etc.

Buying second hand from a yard sometimes is actually no better than buying privately because the yard only has brokerage and therefore no guarantee is given or implied.

Also don't be fooled by extras "thrown in free" most are just junk like the few rods n reels fit for the bin.

Now that this has got you thinking twice bring someone who knows boats ( a marine surveyor is a good bet) along with you to check out the boat before you part with the cash because there are genuine bargains to had out there too!


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Postby the dirty fecker » Wed May 17, 2006 10:05 am

There is nothing wrong with Orkneys but 7,000 is a lot of buying power. It depends on how you will do your fishing. Do you plan to launch and retreive all the time or will you be mooring? There are a lot of good boats out there and many would suit your needs. There are many seahogs that would be within your budget. I WOULD recomend the buy and sell. True there are dodgy buys anywhere but there are also bargains to be had. Saves going through a middle man and saves money and allows you to buy a better boat for your money. Especially when you are purchasing above the €4,000 mark. For 3 anglers the Sea King, Samurai, Commodore, Trooper etc. will fit your needs but you will have to wait for a good deal. Various Orkneys, Wilson Flyer, Icelander, Alaska and Pilot will also meet your needs. Give us more infor 8) mation and we will point you in the right direction.
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Postby TMAC » Wed May 17, 2006 1:23 pm

Thanks for all the advice folks, all good stuff so far. To answer some questions in the above posts.

1. The boat will not be moored. This is one of the reasons I was thinking of orkney, easy to launch I'm told.

2. I don't think traveling to the UK would be an option. There are 4 of us involved and I would prefer if everyone was there to have a look when buying. Would there be enough of a saving on a boat costing 7k to justify traveling across the water? What buying in the north.

3. A marine surveyor was mentioned by Mohawk. Is it possible to pay someone to go out and check out a boat.

What is the difference in the Orkney range between the fastliner, longliner, strikeliner and 520. Any advice which would be the better purchase for a novice.

I found this article on world of sea fishing website with some good advice for first time buyers.

http://www.worldseafishing.com/boats/buyingaboat.shtml

Cheers,

TMAC
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Postby terry » Wed May 17, 2006 2:21 pm

HI Tmac

As luke says the buy and sell can be good for bargains but as you said this is your first boat buy which is why i didnt recommend it, ya get a lot of
"yeah its spotless" and after a long journey to get to see it your usually let down.

The orkney strikeliner,longliner,fastliner are semi displacement hulls which are slower moving boats,. Although fine safe boats.
heres a longliner
Image
heres one with a cuddy
Image
heres a strikeliner
Image
heres a fastliner 19ft
Image
And finally heres a 520, you can see the different shape/slope degree on the hull.
Image


The 520s hull is more sloped which is faster as it cuts through the water better, ie get further quicker.

I personally think a fastliner 19 with cuddy would be a ideal boat if there is three or more of you with plenty of space and stability.
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Postby the dirty fecker » Wed May 17, 2006 3:14 pm

It worries me when you say 4 people are involved. I have been down this path with my first boat and from experience i tell you that make sure you have it laid out plain on paper as to the responsibilities held by all. Parthnerships rarely work. Even among good friends. They cause problems and friction among friends when not all goes to plan. If you can afford to buy your boat alone i would strongly recomend it. People argue and lay blame. It may not always be said but it is always there. Remember why you are buying a boat with friends- they are your friends. parthnerships cause problems and make enemys. Look at rock bands... They never intended to argue or fight but it happens a lot. once money is involved problems arrise. You never think that will happen with your friends but it can!

Aswell as this if you must go down the parthnership route try to keep the number involved to a minimum. Too many cooks as they say... Be thinking about when something goes wrong, say when you need a new engine. Will there be one of you who has not got the money or does not want to? This will surely hold the others back... Most of all be sure that anyone involved is as enthusiastic as you are. If they are not you WILL have problems when money has to be coughed up to solve problems. This is my advice. Been there done that and would never go back.

As for boats the Orkneys are good boats and i would go along with Terry regarding the Fastliner but for four anglers it would be a bit tight. Three yes no problem but 4... To be honest i can not think of many 'small' boats that would fish 4 in comfort. My own boat will fish four but it is the exception rather than the norm and they don't come cheap. The Seahog Commodore will fish four as will the Sea King. The number of anglers in a boat effects engine performance considerably. Especially four.
The Seahog Sealord and Redbay fastfisher 19 are other sizable boats that would house 4 anglers.

Will all four of you expect to go out in the boat together? There are few small boats that will accomadate 4 anglers comfortably
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Postby sailerman » Thu May 18, 2006 2:31 pm

My advice to you is to buy a second hand boat without the engine,and buy a new engine,otherwise your buying someone,s trouble.
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